Today my guest is Gretchen Lee Salter, Senior Program and Policy Manager for the Breast Cancer Fund. We’ll be talking about a new report called Disrupted Development: The Dangers of Prenatal BPA Exposure, which is about how a pregnant woman’s exposure to BPA can affect her child’s development after birth and throughout their lives. Gretchen has played a leading role in the passage of landmark laws in California, including bans on toxic chemicals in children’s toys and feeding products and legislation that established the state’s biomonitoring, Safe Cosmetics and Safer Consumer Products programs. These efforts have served as models for environmental health policy in other states and federally. Gretchen also manages the Breast Cancer Fund’s Cans Not Cancer corporate accountability campaign, which has resulted in Campbell’s announcing it will phase out the use of the toxic chemical BPA. Before joining the Breast Cancer Fund, she worked as an organizer, advocate and activist in both legislative and electoral politics, including serving as the national budget director for the Democratic National Committee and working on presidential campaigns. Gretchen received a B.A. from the University of California at Davis. www.breastcancerfund.org

TOXIC FREE TALK RADIO
The Dangers of Prenatal Exposure to Bisphenol-A (BPA)

Host: Debra Lynn Dadd
Guest: Gretchen Lee Salter

Date of Broadcast: November 26, 2013

DEBRA: Hi, I’m Debra Lynn Dadd. And this is Toxic Free Talk Radio where we talk about how to thrive in a toxic world.

It’s Tuesday, November 26, 2013. And I’m here in Clearwater, Florida, where it’s going to rain. And today, we are talking about something that is very, very, very important—not that everything on the show isn’t important, everything is important. But this is particularly a subject that affects everyone.

All toxic chemicals affect everyone, but this is something that’s happening to every person practically on the planet. Everybody is exposed to this. And particularly, it’s a problem, what we’re going to be talking about today, for women who are pregnant because it affects the health of the fetus once it’s born for the rest of their life.

Anyway, listen, just listen because this is really important.

My guest today is Gretchen Lee Salter. She’s the senior program and policy manager for the Breast Cancer Fund. They’ve just issued a report called Disrupted Development: The Dangers of Prenatal BPA Exposure.

Now, I know you’ve all heard about BPA and how it’s ubiquitous in our environment. But Gretchen is going to tell us how it affects our health, and particularly, the health of children yet to be born.

Hi, Gretchen. Thanks for being with me.

GRETCHEN LEE SALTER: Hi, Debra. It’s my pleasure. Thanks so much for having me.

DEBRA: You’re welcome. I can’t tell you how important I think your report is. But first, before we talk about it, tell us a little bit about how you got into this field, and also about the Breast Cancer Fund.

GRETCHEN LEE SALTER: Sure, sure. Well, the Breast Cancer Fund, we’re a national organization. And we’re based in San Francisco. We were founded in 1992 by a woman named Andrea Ravinett Martin who, at 42, was diagnosed with breast cancer—the first woman in her family to be diagnosed with breast cancer. She was given a 40% 5-year survival rate. She was basically told to go home and put her affairs in order.

After a grueling treatment, and another diagnosis, she felt that putting her affairs in order meant funding this organization. And we’re all so happy she did.

She started in the ‘90s as a funding organization. But in around 2000/2001, we shifted our focus to really be focused on advocacy and focused solely on breast cancer prevention by identifying and advocating for the elimination of the toxic chemicals in radiation that are linked to the disease.

We have seen huge upticks in the rates of breast cancer over the last 40 years. In fact, breast cancer incidents has tripled in the last 40 years. And that really goes hand in hand with our increased use of industrial chemicals.

DEBRA: We’re going to talk about BPA in your report. But as long as we’re just right here, can you just mention some of the chemicals that you found in your organization contribute to breast cancer?

GRETCHEN LEE SALTER: Sure! Well, there are several. So, bisphenol-A certainly is one that we’ve been focused on quite a bit. But there are a number of breast carcinogens. Benzene is something that’s used quite a lot in the workplace. We’ve looked a lot at a chemical called phthalates, which are a plasticizer that is used in PVC plastic to make it soft and malleable, but it’s also used in fragrances to help spread the fragrance around.

And there’s just really a whole host of chemicals that you can find that have been linked to the disease.

Actually, we have published a compendium of research—and we do this every couple of years or so—called State of the Evidence where we aggregate all of the scientific evidence on chemicals that are linked to breast cancer and radiation linked to breast cancer. And we put the research all in one place, and put it in a way that is very easy to understand for a lay audience. I’m certainly not a scientist. And our scientists here have really made it very easy for me to do my job.

So, one of the biggest contributors we’re seeing to breast cancer is to spread something called endocrine-disrupting chemicals. And bisphenol-A falls under that as well as a number of others like phthalates that I’ve mentioned, some of the flame retardants, PBDE’s (people have heard of those), triclosan, which is used very often in antibacterial hand soaps or antibacterial cleaners. They’re all endocrine-disrupting compounds.

And those are things that we are really, really looking at, and have been looking at, for the last few years or so because of their ability to either mimic or disrupt our normal hormonal processes.

And breast cancer is really a disease that’s driven by hormones. A woman’s lifetime exposure to estrogen—this is a very crude way to state it. But a woman’s lifetime exposure to estrogen is directly related to her increased risk for breast cancer. So, the more estrogen or estrogen-like compounds you are exposed to, the higher your risk of breast cancer. Again, that’s a very crude way to put it. But in a nutshell, that’s basically it.

And so, when you have chemicals like bisphenol-A, like phthalates, like triclosan that are able to mimic our hormones, that’s really concerning to us because we know that our hormones work in explicitly low doses. We’re talking in the parts per billion, parts per trillion. And so, even just a little bit can set somebody off in the wrong direction.

And as you mentioned, where we are most concerned right now is in early childhood and in prenatal development.

DEBRA: I just want to commend your organization for making a switch from fundraising to fight the illness to having your work be focused on preventing the illness and identifying the toxic chemicals. I think that’s so important. That’s what I’ve been doing for 30 years. So I’m very happy to see that you’re doing this in the area of breast cancer, that you’ve chosen an area to focus on so that we can find out what the information is and apply that in our lives.

GRETCHEN LEE SALTER: Thank you so much. And thank you so much for the work that you do as well.

When we decided to change the focus of the organization, we really took a look at the breast cancer field. We wanted to find out what was missing. And there are a lot of great organizations that are focused on access to treatment, and trying to find a cure, and improving therapies. And those are all incredibly important things. I don’t want to minimize that at all.

But where we saw a big hole was in this prevention piece. And as we all know, an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure.

DEBRA: Absolutely!

GRETCHEN LEE SALTER: And so we thought this is something that needs more attention.

And I think, a lot of times, people think about chemicals and toxins in our lives as an environmental issue. But how we see it, this is really a public health issue. This is something that is affecting our health on a day-to-day basis.

I have personally been very lucky in that—you asked how I came to this organization. I’ve been lucky in that I’m one of the few people that have not had any breast cancer, or really cancer, in my family. But that doesn’t mean really anything at this point because I know what I’ve been exposed to, I know with my three-year-old daughter. And I’m currently pregnant, I know what my baby is being exposed to even though I try to live as cleanly as possible.

And so for me, I am doing this for the next generation. And I am so happy that I have been able to work at the Breast Cancer Fund and focus our attention on prevention, which I think is ultimately going to win the day.

DEBRA: I think so too. And this morning, I actually found out—and I don’t think I have the quote right here in front of me. But I was researching something, and I came across the Pollution Prevention Act from 1990, the Federal Pollution Prevention Act from 1990.

And it says right there, very clearly—and I’m not quoting them because I don’t have it in front of me—that the number one thing to do is to reduce the pollutants at the source. And that’s exactly what you and I and many others are talking about is reducing.

Actually, it says, “Congress says that we should be reducing pollution at the source.”

I had actually never heard that statement before. But it’s actually law that we should be doing this in the United States. We could have a whole other show about what’s not happening according to the law.

We’re going to pick our subject. Just when I read that I went, “Oh, my god. There’s actually a law in the United States of America that we should be reducing toxic chemical exposure.”

And we need to go to a break, but we’ll be right back. I’m Debra Lynn Dadd. This is Toxic Free Talk Radio. And my guest today is Gretchen Lee Salter from the Breast Cancer Fund. When we come back, we’re going to talk about the dangers of prenatal BPA exposure.

Now, everything we’re about to start talking about is from a report called Disrupted Development: The Dangers of Prenatal BPA Exposure. And you can get that by going to ToxicFreeTalkRadio.com, and looking for today’s show. I have a link to it there. It will give you everything we’re going to say you can read about in the report (at least I think most of what we’re going to say will be in the report).

Gretchen, let’s just start out with the brief history of BPA and talk about what the health effects are.

GRETCHEN LEE SALTER: So, BPA is short of bisphenol-A. And it is a chemical that was originally synthesized to actually be a synthetic estrogen replacement. And it was shelved in favor of other stronger estrogens which I can talk about a little bit later.

But an enterprising scientist was able to figure out that this chemical made really great plastic and great shatter-proof plastic.

So that polycarbonate, hard, clear plastic you see has bisphenol-A in it.

It’s also used to line food cans to keep the metal separate from the food. And it’s also used in thermographic receipt paper.

Unfortunately, this chemical is really not very stable at all, so it leeches out of plastic. It leeches out of food cans into our food.

And on the receipt paper itself that really, it just ends up on our fingers quite a bit. So there’s a lot of exposure.

Ninety-three percent of the American population has BPA in their bodies right now according to the CDC. It’s a pretty ubiquitous chemical. And studies have really shown that this is a chemical which is—it’s not very surprising considering it was put on the market originally synthesized to be an estrogen replacement. And sure enough, it does mimic estrogen.

And this is one of those chemicals that I was talking about before called an endocrine-disrupting chemical in that it operates in very, very low doses. So we’re seeing health effects in the parts per billion, parts per trillion range. And we are seeing exposure to BPA leading to increased risk for health effects like breast cancer, prostate cancer, learning disabilities, other neurological problems, obesity, diabetes and early puberty.

So, BPA is used, like I said, in a number of different applications. And the Breast Cancer Fund and our allies, the Environmental Health Movement, have been trying for years to get it out of plastics and out of food cans, and out of receipt papers. And we really focused for the first part of this movement on kid’s products—on baby bottles and on infant formula.

And while that was an absolutely necessary thing to do, and we are 100% confident that that was the right thing to do, in a way, it almost came at the expense of the most vulnerable population—and that really is the prenatal environment, a developing fetus because the developing fetus is so susceptible to hormonal exposure and hormonal changes.

The fetus is growing and changing every day, but growth is really directed by hormones. And when you introduce a hormone mimicker like bisphenol-A into the picture, it really can throw off development and set that baby on a course for increased risk for later life disease.

And so, I think a lot of people have a hard time figuring out what the heck is a breast cancer organization and the things that usually hit people in middle age or later in life doing focusing on prenatal exposures? But if we really are going to prevent breast cancer, that’s where we have to start because, unfortunately, that’s where breast cancer starts.

DEBRA: So, I’d just like to interrupt for a second and just add a little bit more information here because there’s a lot of things that go on in our bodies that I know even as a writer in this subject for many, many years, I had to learn when we came up with endocrine disrupters like, “What is that?”

And so, I just want to explain that one of the ways that the body communicates is through hormones. And so there’s a hormone and there’s a hormone receptor site. And what happens is that it’s like putting a key in a lock. The hormone goes in to the receptor site, and it gives it information. And that makes your body run.

Now, what happens with these endocrine disruptors is that, as Gretchen has been saying, that they mimic a hormone. And so, they’re in your body, and they bind a hormone receptor site, and it’s similar enough. And what they do is that they go in into the site as if they are a hormone, and then when the real hormone comes along, there’s no space for the hormone to go into the site. And so your body doesn’t get the information that it’s supposed to have.

And when I read that, I was just horrified when I learned that. Disruption is the right word because the whole communicate just gets disrupted.

I just wanted to add that so the people would understand how that works, how serious this is.

GRETCHEN LEE SALTER: Thank you so much. That’s a really great way to explain that. I forgot to explain that way before.

It’s exactly right. Either the hormone, the actual physical hormone, that the body is telling to fire cannot get into that lock, or that lock wasn’t supposed to be open in the first place at that time. And so it really is, like you said, just disrupting the whole development.

And so what we did in our report would look at the scientific data on prenatal exposures to BPA. We first wanted to see is exposure happening. BPA is one those chemicals that—well, the good news is, it actually flushes out of the body relatively quickly. Within 24 to 48 hours, BPA is processed through the body and leaves the body.

The bad news is, because it’s so ubiquitous, we are constantly re-exposed over time. And that is why we came up with this 93% figure that the CDC says are exposed because even though it travels through us so quickly, we’re exposed every day.

And so it’s not as though because we’re getting rid of it, it’s a good thing if you’re just constantly re-exposing yourself.

So, we wanted to see if this exposure was actually happening in utero. We used to think that the placenta really filtered all the bad things out.

DEBRA: And before you tell us about that, we need to take a break. So I’m just going to interrupt you before you start talking about it. You’re listening to Toxic Free Talk Radio. I’m Debra Lynn Dadd. And my guest today is Gretchen Lee Salter. We’re talking about what happens in prenatal exposure when mothers, pregnant women, consume BPA. We’ll be right back.

And Gretchen, you were talking about why we have to start with prenatal exposure in order to prevent breast cancer.

GRETCHEN LEE SALTER: Sure! And as I was saying, breast cancer really does start in the womb. That is where our development really starts. And as we’ve talked about earlier, our hormones are really directing that development. And so when we introduce synthetic hormones like BPA, it really disrupts that environment.

And so, what our report did is that we looked at all of the scientific data on prenatal exposures to BPA, both the animal and human data, and found that, first of all, yes, fetuses are exposed to BPA in the womb. The placenta is not filtering BPA out.

And we have found BPA in umbilical cord blood, in amniotic fluid, and in fetuses themselves in animal models.

And then, we looked at the data to look at the health effects of that prenatal exposure to see if we’re seeing increased risk for diseases like breast cancer, prostate cancer, early puberty. And sure enough, yes, the scientific evidence is showing us that prenatal exposure to BPA is leading to increased risk for all of the diseases that I had mentioned.

It’s something that’s a little bit counterintuitive in a way because I think we’ve all been so conditioned to think, “We need to focus on babies. And we need to focus on small children,” which is incredibly important and, of course, we should focus on that early stage of life, but we are missing a critical window, and that is really the fetal exposure. And the only way to protect fetuses and to protect those that are in the womb is really to protect everybody. You really have to protect the pregnant mother, and you have to look at what she’s buying. And she’s buying what adults are exposed to.

So, it’s not enough to tell pregnant women, “Well, it’s your responsibility. It’s your fault.” Pregnant women have enough to worry about, as one myself, I know. There’s a lot of pressure put on pregnant women. And so, I don’t want this to seem as though we are putting one more thing on pregnant women. What we are calling for is for companies to stop using BPA in their canned foods, to stop using it in receipt paper. And we’re calling on the government to start having common sense laws that won’t allow chemicals like BPA in canned foods in the first place.

DEBRA: I totally agree. I should mention that there are several companies that are already using BPA-free cans, small, natural and organic companies. So the technology already exists. It’s not like that a company could say, “Well, there are no BPA-free cans.” There are! And people are using them. And it’s just a matter of a company choosing that.

Now, I don’t know what the expenses are, but obviously, companies are already doing it. And it’s just a choice. If they need to charge three more cents in order to have a BPA-free can, I’m sure that wouldn’t make a lot of difference in their sales.

And also, cash register receipts, it’s the same thing. There are cash register receipts available that do not have BPA. So again, it’s a choice.

Wherever you go, you could just start asking people, “Well, does this cash register receipt you’re about to put in my hands, does it have BPA?” Just start talking about these things because it is a choice. It’s not a matter of—we don’t have to develop new technology. These products already exist. It’s just that people need to use them.

GRETCHEN LEE SALTER: In the case of cans, this is something that has actually been a little bit difficult for the industry because the technology wasn’t really there in terms of a one-for-one chemical substitute that works for everything.
BPA is very convenient. And it works for all kinds of foods. But some of the alternatives that are out there—not all, but some of the alternatives—don’t work for highly acidic foods, foods that are high in sodium. So it may be a variety of alternatives.

But as you mentioned, some companies have already gone completely BPA-free. And those are Annie’s Organics and Amy’s Kitchen. They are both completely BPA-free. Of course, we are still trying to figure out what it is they’re actually using in place of BPA. Our understanding is that it’s a modified polyester, and our question back is, “Well, modified by what?” We don’t know.

And so, this is something where the answers are not completely crystal clear. But at this point, the good news is that every single can manufacturer has committed to transitioning away from BPA. But as you said, it’s a choice in terms of how long are they going to take to really make that transition.

And so, we’ve been calling on can manufacturers for the last couple of years to not only get out of BPA, but to tell consumers what it is that they’re using because the last thing we want to do is go from a chemical like BPA to something that’s just as bad or even worse.

So, for this, it’s just really critical that the alternatives are actually safer, and that companies are being very transparent about this because consumers, at this point, are educated. They’re not willing to buy something if they don’t know what’s in it.

DEBRA: I think that’s true, and this is something that I’ve been saying for years and years and years. How can we know if the companies don’t disclose?

An example I often use is that if you’re buying apple sauce, the label should say “apples, polluted water, pesticides, et cetera,” so that you really know what it is that you’re getting, instead of having to go over to the organic one and have it say “organically grown, filtered water.”

What’s happening in the labeling now and in the marketing is that companies are advertising what they don’t contain, but the companies that are selling the toxic products are not required to disclose what they do contain in terms of the toxic chemicals.

Cleaning products are some of the most toxic chemicals on the market, and yet, the labeling laws specifically for cleaning products says you don’t have to tell the customer what’s in the product as long as you put the little warning label on it that says “danger, caution,” skull and cross bones.

This is ridiculous. We should have open transparency. We should be able to know everything accurately that is in any packaged product, so that we can make the proper choices ourselves.

GRETCHEN LEE SALTER: Absolutely! And the Breast Cancer Fund, in addition to it calling on manufacturers, have been working both in Congress but also with state legislators because state legislators are really the ones who are at the forefront of this movement, of the toxics movement.

A number are introducing legislation. A number haven’t used legislation in the past to regulate BPA in baby bottles. And now, they are starting to move on to canned food. And so we’re very excited about that.

And the great news is that it was really the threat of legislation and a couple of states passing legislation that actually was able to make the market shift away from BPA in baby bottles and sippy cups. And we’re hoping that the same proves true in canned food. We think that a number of states are going to start regulating this and are going to start introducing legislation.

And we’re hoping that that push will push the market faster so that BPA can be a thing of the past.

DEBRA: Good! I would like to see that too. We need to take another break. And we’ll be right back with Gretchen Lee Salter from the Breast Cancer Fund to talk about how we can reduce our exposure to BPA. I’m Debra Lynn Dadd. This is Toxic Free Talk Radio. We’ll be right back.

And as Gretchen mentioned earlier, they have some information about other toxic chemicals besides BPA that contribute to breast cancer. So you can get all that information there, and it’s a worthwhile organization to support.

So Gretchen, I totally am in agreement with everything that you’re doing to get regulations changed, to get manufacturers changed. And my viewpoint for the past 30-plus years has been that, while all that stuff is happening, we still need to be protecting ourselves individually. That’s what I write about.

So, I just want us to talk a little bit about how individuals can reduce their BPA exposure. And we’ve already talked about the BPA in the cash register receipts. So what are some tips that women could do when they’re buying things? What do they need to do to reduce that exposure?

GRETCHEN LEE SALTER: Well, for the time being, we’re saying to try to limit your exposures to canned food. And it’s tough because canned food is very convenient. And certainly, at this time of year, fresh vegetables are not readily available in a lot of places.

But there are some great strategies and some very cost-effective strategies to getting vegetables that don’t come from a can, like buying frozen vegetables. They are often healthier for you because they don’t contain the sodium that’s often used in canned food.

And a lot of soups now are coming in these cardboard containers, these [inaudible 28:13] containers that are manufactured by a company called Tetra Pak. And so you can find these cardboard containers that contain soups, they sometimes contain tomatoes. And we’re finding that those are increasingly being used in place of canned food. And so you can find them right just there in the canned food aisle.

Another really important thing to do when you’re eating out is to ask your waiter, ask your server, if any of the food that they are preparing has come from a can. Try to find items on the menu that don’t contain canned food.

The other big thing is—and I know we talked about receipts, but very often, we’re handed receipts, and we just grab them and go. The biggest thing is to wash your hands to make sure—and especially before you eat—that BPA isn’t getting into a sandwich or whatever it is that you’re eating.

And when it comes to plastics, BPA has really been removed from a lot of our plastic food containers. Most reusable water bottles are BPA-free. Most baby bottles, sippy cups, food storage containers, are all BPA-free at this point. But again, we are running into this problem of not knowing exactly what the alternative is being used.

So, we are still recommending that, for a reusable water bottle, go out and get a stainless steel water bottle, like a Klean Kanteen. We know that they don’t contain BPA or any other plastic, and we know that they are safe.

For storing food, we still recommend using glass, Pyrex containers with lids.

And really, one of the biggest things too is do not microwave in plastic, especially when you get a frozen dinner. Put it on a plate and stick it in the microwave. Don’t microwave it in that plastic because we just don’t know what’s in there. As you said, the labeling laws are just very few and far between. And so, it’s very difficult to know what chemicals are where. And so we know that microwaving in glass or ceramic, or storing food in glass or ceramic, is a much safer option than plastic.

DEBRA: Also, what we need to remember about plastic is that heat will make plastic outgas more. It will make the phthalates release from the plastic. And so if you’re using plastic like those plastic storage containers, don’t put hot food in it. Wait until the food cools down, and then put it in whatever the container is. That will minimize the plastic getting into your food if you choose to use plastic.

And also, freezing things in plastic, when you make a plastic colder, it will release less plastic. When you make it hotter, it releases more. And that includes water bottles sitting out in the sun, in front of the convenience store, and things like that. So, watch out for the temperature of plastics.

GRETCHEN LEE SALTER: As much as possible, just try to reduce plastic in your everyday life. It’s tough this day and age.

It’s really, really hard. I totally get it. But as much as you can, just reduce your use of plastic and increase your use of stainless steel and glass containers.

DEBRA: I totally agree. Now I would also add that in addition to buying frozen food instead, or using [inaudible 31:47] instead, I always like to suggest that people fix their own food at home.

For a long time, I thought that if I bought something in glass, like pasta sauce in glass, that there would be no cans involved.

But then one day, I was talking to a woman at a farmers market who was selling pasta sauce in glass. And I asked her about her ingredients, and she very proudly told me how she used canned tomatoes, Italian canned tomatoes.

GRETCHEN LEE SALTER: I think, as much as possible, make food at home. What we try to really focus on is—you know, for some people, that’s just not realistic. That doesn’t work all the time. For me, I love to make soup that, my gosh, trying to find the time to do that can sometimes be challenging. So if you can’t do it, I think you’re absolutely right, the best thing to do is to make your own food and to buy fresh fruits and vegetables. If that’s not an option, go for frozen, go for things in glasses, or [inaudible 32:55] containers.

DEBRA: What I found over the years is that it really is a progression of taking steps in the right direction. And one of the best choice might be to buy—well, not even buy, but grow all your organic food in your backyard, which is something I can’t make happen in my life. But then you just back up and say, “Well, could I buy organic food?” Well, if not, could you buy something that’s not in a can? And you just keep backing up to see where you are, and then taking those baby steps forward.

I’ve seen tremendous improvement in having things be less toxic over the last 30 years. It’s funny because, in some ways, we know more now about what’s toxic. And it seems more frightening. But hand in hand, we also have more non-toxic products than we’ve ever had. We have more organic products. We have more choices. We have more availability.

So, it’s just a matter of making those choices one by one, doing the best we can, knowing what the options are, and then making the choices that we can make. Even if we can’t make the absolute, most optimum choice, there’s a step that we can take in the right direction.

GRETCHEN LEE SALTER: You’re absolutely right. This is definitely a continuum. And I think there’s access in some communities and non-access in other communities.

I think our real challenge too is to make sure that access to fresh, healthy options are available everywhere, not just in some communities, and not just in higher income communities. We’re actually seeing that low income communities have higher rates of BPA exposure than in middle or upper income communities.

So, this is a huge issue. It’s a big environmental justice and a social justice issue. And so we want to make sure that everybody can be protected, not just those who can afford to be.

DEBRA: We should all be living in a safe and healthy and not toxic world. I think that we all have the human right to have that life liberty and the pursuit of happiness. Life is the first thing. And how can we be alive and well if we’re being constantly exposed to toxic chemicals?

So, we need to be acting as individuals, but also collectively to say what’s good for all of us. And that’s where I admire what you’re doing and other organizations. I admire so much that you’re making the world a better place.

I would love to be out of a job because I would love to be able to say, “There is no more need for me to tell individuals what to do to protect themselves from toxic chemical exposures” because there wouldn’t be any. That’s my goal.

GRETCHEN LEE SALTER: We would too. And I think that that’s something that is very hard for some folks in the chemical industry to understand who accuse us of just trying to scare people to stir up money. And that’s really not what we’re doing.

We’re trying to get information out there, so that we don’t have to be doing this. There are a lot of problems in the world. It would be great if we could tick one off of our list, and tick this one off.

This is easy. It’s very, very easy. It’s just a matter of having the political will to actually do the right thing and change our laws so that chemicals like bisphenol-A and like the other ones that I had mentioned will never be allowed in the market in the first place.

DEBRA: Yes, that’s my goal too. Well, thank you so much for being with me today, Gretchen. I’m sure that everybody learned a lot on this very, very, very important subject. It’s really vital for us to see how far it goes back to the very conception almost of—well, I would say, maybe even pre-conception, of the health of the father and mother and the quality of the material that the fetus is made out of, the toxic chemicals that might be there. It just pervades everything. So everything that each of us are doing is all making a difference.

So, you’ve been listening to Toxic Free Talk Radio. And I just had a thunderclap. We’re going to have a thunderstorm right now.

This is Toxic Free Talk Radio. I’m Debra Lynn Dadd. And happy Thanksgiving!