Today I have three guests. We’ll be talking about a Cell Phone “Right ot Know” Ordinance being proposed in Berkeley California—about the ordinance, what it requires, and why it is needed. We’ll be discussing use recommendations from cell phone manufacturers and some surprising health effects of cell phone use (did you know storing your cell phone in your bra can cause breast cancer?).

Ellen Marks is founder and director of the California Brain Tumor Association which focuses on prevention and on the wireless radiation issue being a possible cause of deadly brain tumors. Ellen entered into the cell phone/brain tumor world when her husband was diagnosed with brain cancer in 2008. After examining her husband’s cell phone and medical records worldwide experts confirmed that her husband’s glioma was “more likely than not” attributable to his long term ipsilateral cell phone use. Ellen has testified before Congress on the health effects of cell phone radiation and has appeared on the Dr. Oz Show, Larry King Live, The View and many national newscasts. www.cabta.org

Dr. John West, M.D. is general surgeon. In the mid 1980’s, he became fascinated with the multidisciplinary team approach to breast cancer care. His previous experience as a pioneer in the development of regional trauma systems set the stage for his interest in developing a team approach to breast care. He opened Orange County’s first breast care center in 1988, and over the past 20 yrs has been on the cutting edge of developing a team approach to the care of patients with breast problems. Dr. West has been named a Best Doctor in America and has been recognized as one of the “Best Doctors in Orange County”. He has been the lead author in 20 peer review articles and has written two books. Dr. West continues to be at the forefront of cutting edge breast care issues. He was co-founder and chairman of the board of the Breast Health Awareness Foundation, which is a community outreach program dedicated to the early detection of breast cancer. Dr. West’s interests include physical fitness, gardening, and scuba diving. He is a workaholic who often jokes that his favorite saying is “Thank God it’s Monday.” Beawarefoundation.org | www.hindawi.com/journals/crim/2013/354682/

Dr. Devra Lee Davis, M.P.H., Ph.D, is recognized internationally for her work on environmental health and disease prevention. A Presidential appointee that received bi-partisan Senate confirmation, Dr. Davis was the Founding Director of the world’s first Center for Environmental Oncology and currently serves as President of Environmental Health Trust, a nonprofit devoted to researching and controlling avoidable environmental health threats. A national book award finalist, Dr. Davis lectures at universities in the U.S. and Europe and was the recent winner of the Carnegie Science Medal in 2010 and the Lifetime Achievement Award from Green America in 2012. Her 2007 book, The Secret History of the War on Cancer, details the ways that public relations strategies have undermined public health, and is being used at major schools of public health, including Harvard, Emory, and Tulane University. Her recent book, Disconnect: The Truth about Cell Phone Radiation and Your Health, what the Industry has Done to Hide it, and What You Can Do to Protect your Family was published in the U.S. and U.K. by Dutton, 2010, and has been released in Australia, India, Turkey, Taiwan, Finland, Estonia, China, and as a book on tape. Her research has appeared in major scientific journals. Her research has been featured on CNN, CSPAN, CBC, BBC, and public radio. ehtrust.org

 

 

 

TOXIC FREE TALK RADIO
Berkeley’s Proposed Cell Phone “Right to Know” Ordinance

Host: Debra Lynn Dadd
Guest: Ellen Marks, Dr. John West M.D., Dr. Devra Lee Davis, M.P.H., PhD

Date of Broadcast: November 13, 2014

DEBRA: Hi, I’m Debra Lynn Dadd and this is Toxic Free Talk Radio where we talk about how to thrive in a toxic world and live toxic-free. It’s Thursday, November 13th 2014.

And if you hear banging or whirring or any kind of noises in the background, it’s because I’m having a new water filter installed. There’s nothing wrong with my old water filter, it’s just that it’s being upgraded because the company who made my water filter, Pure Effect is coming out with a new filter next week.

And in fact, we’re going to learn all about it next Tuesday, on next Tuesday show. So I got one in advance and so I’m trying it out. It’s getting installed today and it’s an interesting filter. We’re going to hear about it on Tuesday, so I won’t get into it today.

Today, we’re going to be talking about the city of Berkeley, California and their proposed cellphone “Right to Know” ordinance. My guest today – I actually have three guests, but my first guest is Ellen Marks. She’s the founder and director of the California Brain Tumor Association, which focuses on prevention and on the wireless radiation issue as a possible cause of deadly brain tumors.

Now, you may have heard Ellen back on April 28th when she was on. I invited her on because she and others had just done a protest in San Francisco store by placing warning labels on the cellphones.

And now what we’re talking about today is a proposed ordinance in Berkeley, California where it will require stores that sells cellphone to give a fact sheet that talks about what is the safest way to use a cellphone.

Hi, Ellen!

ELLEN MARKS: Hi, Debra. Thank you for having me on again.

DEBRA: Thank you so much. You’re welcome. Thank you so much for being here. And I’ll just say before you and I start talking that the other guests will be appearing later in the show. In the second segment, we’ll be having Dr. John West who works with cellphones and breast cancer.

And in the third second will be Dr. Devra Lee Davis who is a well-known research in the field of EMS and author of the book, Disconnect: The Truth About Cellphone Radiation and Your Health, What the Industry Has Done to Hide It and What You Can Do to Protect Your Family – long title. Anyway, she’ll be on in the third segment, so we’re going to be learning lots today about how cellphones can protect your health if they’re worn near your body.

So Ellen, tell us what the issue is and why an ordinance?

ELLEN MARKS: Well, the issue is in a nutshell, the FTC mandates that the manufacturers put in disclosures. What the manufacturers are doing right now is hiding this information in the manual or in the phone. So what they’re requiring to be there is that the phone should not be held to the body.

When it’s held to the body, one may be exposed to radiation that exceeds the federal exposure guideline. So every manual has this information in it. It could be on page 296 and size four font and people just don’t know that they’re there.

DEBRA: Well, the other thing that I noticed is that it doesn’t even tell you in words that we understand what the distance is. I was just looking at one on the Apple iPhone 5. I have an iPhone and it says, “Carry the iPhone at least 10 mm. away from your body.” Well, who in America knows what a 10 mm. is. How far is that?

ELLEN MARKS: Exactly! That’s about a half an inch. But the bigger problem (and that is a huge problem) that people are not seeing this. The FTC says that the end user must see this and they must understand it. And that is not happening.

And the other issue with the iPhone is – I don’t know how you found it because one has to go through many steps to get there. You have to hit ‘settings’, then you have to hit ‘general’, then you have to hit ‘about’ – I’m doing this right now.

And then you have to go down the ‘legal’, then you have to go to ‘RF exposure’ and then in print that you can’t make bigger, it does tell you, “Carry the iPhone at least 10 mm. away from your body to ensure exposure levels remain at or below the as-tested levels.”

So it’s a combination of understanding what they’re telling you and being able to find what they’re telling you.

DEBRA: Well, I’ll tell you…

ELLEN MARKS: And that’s the issue in Berkeley.

DEBRA: Yeah. Honestly, I’ll tell you that I didn’t find it on my phone. I found it on the email that you sent me while you were giving examples.
ELLEN MARKS: Okay, okay. So people don’t know this.

DEBRA: …examples of fine print, separation advisories. And when I bought my iPhone, I didn’t even think twice about this. They didn’t tell me anything at the store, I didn’t read the manual. I just started holding it up to my head.

ELLEN MARKS: Exactly!

DEBRA: And I don’t do that anymore. I don’t do that anymore.

ELLEN MARKS: Well, that’s good.

DEBRA: Since you were on the show and you told us about this, I now use the speaker feature and I hold it away like a foot away and talk into the speaker.

ELLEN MARKS: Well, that’s wonderful because what we’re trying to do is raise awareness and educate people that this information is there and there’s reasons for this information being there.

So what Berkeley has proposed – and first of all, I want to thank Max Anderson and Chris Worthington, the two city council members who are introducing this legislation and they’ve been steadfast in their efforts. What it says, the proposed wording of the ordinance, what it would say would be a handout given to anyone when they buy a cellphone. So it would be at the point of sale instead of hiding it the way it is now. What it would say is:

“The federal government requires that cellphones meet radio frequency (RF) exposure guidelines. Don’t carry or use your phone in a pants or shirt pocket or tucked into a bra when the phone is turned on and connected to a wireless network. This will prevent exposure to RF levels that may exceed the federal guidelines. Refer to the instructions in your phone or user manual for the recommended separation distance.”

DEBRA: That, I think is excellent.

ELLEN MARKS: Well, it’s good. It’s fairly minimal, but we have to do that because this industry has already threatened a lawsuit. They’ve done this in other places across the nation who have tried similar legislation. But this is more minimal. This is not violating the industry’s first amendment rights because it’s not compelling speech and it’s not controversial.

It’s merely taking the information that already exist in the phone and in the FTC compliance document and putting it in the consumer’s hand at the point of sale so that individuals and parents can make informed choices as to how they and their children will use these devices. These should not be held to the body when they’re on.

DEBRA: Here’s just a practical question. If you need to leave your phone on, don’t you, in order to receive a call?

ELLEN MARKS: Mm-hmmm…

DEBRA: So one would have to just make sure that they carry it. I now have a little case, a Pong case for mine. I don’t carry it in my pocket or put it in my bra. I put it in my purse or it’s sitting on my desk about two feet away and it’s in my little Pong case.

ELLEN MARKS: Well, you’re absolutely right. That is a huge issue because we all love our phones. I still use one, but I never carry it to my head or to my body. It’s a valuable technology. Many of us are probably addicted to this device. So where do we keep it?

For women, they can keep it in their purse. Men should keep it in a briefcase or a backpack. We probably need a new man bag of some sort. But we need an alternative to keeping it in a pocket because as Dr. Devra Davis will tell you later, there’s a lot of science about sperm damage, damage to fetuses. Dr. West will tell you that there’s some information now about young women with unusual breast tumors who keep their cellphones in their bra. So we need an alternative.

And we also need this industry to eventually make safer equipment. They already have the patents on safer equipment, but they’re not releasing it because they would be admitting that there’s a problem and they don’t want to admit that there’s a problem.

DEBRA: Alright! So we need to go to break soon. When we come back, we’re going to be talking with Dr. John West. You can stay on the line, Ellen in case you want to jump in and talk with him because there is two lines. We’ll just keep you on all through the entire show. And then come back in segment four. We’ll talk with you again more about the ordinance.

ELLEN MARKS: Okay, thank you. I look forward to it.

DEBRA: You’re welcome. You’re listening to Toxic Free Talk Radio. I’m Debra Lynn Dadd. And today we’re talking about the proposed Berkeley legislation to have a fact sheet given that tells you about the distances that you should have for your phone and the health effects that people have already found from having your found on next to your body. And when we come back from the break, we’ll be talking with Dr. John West.

= COMMERCIAL BREAK =

DEBRA: You’re listening to Toxic Free Talk Radio. And we’re going to apply the music again – I’m Debra Lynn Dadd – because we just had a little telephone mix-up and we’re going to get Dr. West on the line. So just hold and listen to the music and we’ll be right back.

And the producer is not playing the music because he thinks I’m talking. Okay! Brett, I just skyped you the phone number, so try this new number. And I’ll just talk. Ellie, are you still there? No, nobody is there. Okay, I hope you can hear me. So I will talk because we don’t want to have dead air time here.

I’m going to introduce Dr. West while we’re waiting to get him on the phone. My producer says that he’s calling him and so it should just be momentarily.

So Dr. West is a general surgeon. He’s been interested in breast cancer since the mid-1980s. He has been named one of the best doctors in America and is recognized as one of the best doctors in Orange County. He’s been the lead author in 20 peer review articles, written two books and he’s on the forefront of cutting-edge breast cancer issues.

He’s the co-founder and chairman of the board of the Breast Health Awareness Foundation, a community outreach program dedicated to early detection – and I just got that he’s online. He loves physical fitness, gardening and scuba diving.

Hello, Dr. West.

DR. JOHN WEST: How are you?

DEBRA: I’m fine. How are you?

DR. JOHN WEST: Oh, just fine. Nice day in Southern California.

DEBRA: And it’s a nice day here in Florida.

DR. JOHN WEST: Oh, how about that?

DEBRA: So tell us about your work with breast cancer and cellphones.

DR. JOHN WEST: Well, of course, I’ve dedicated the last 30 years of my life to breast cancer early detection, risk reduction, et cetera. A couple of years ago, a patient, she showed up at our center with a cancer in the upper, inner left breast. She was about 38 years old. She had no family history or any known risk factors, but she said the cancer had occurred directly under where she had been storing her cellphone in her bra.

We were a bit skeptical when we presented her case to our conference and looked at the pathology. It had kind of an unusual appearance. I remember the pathologist commenting on the fact that there was a widespread area of little areas of micro-invasion and this was distinctly unusual.

So it kind of got me thinking, “Well, maybe this lady did have a story to tell.” I presented her case at a big county-wide conference of breast surgeons and basically got laughed off the stage and was told in no uncertain terms that there’s no data whatsoever to support this concept, that cellphones have microwave energy and that microwave energy is safe. And so I kind of, “Okay, guys, I’ll keep my mouth shut.”

So shortly there afterwards, I got contacted by a 21-year old who was diagnosed with what she felt to be a cellphone-related breast cancer. And then over the years, I’ve collected more cases and finally published this series.

But the most dramatic event that really changed my thinking and convinced me that this could be a major problem, it’s in fact the tip of the iceberg, I was sitting in my desk as I usually do during office hours and the radiology technician, two or three of them came running out of the room and said, “Hey, we got another one.”

It turned out to be a 21-year old girl that had what she felt to be a cellphone-related breast cancer, but the appearance of her mammogram was absolutely mind-boggling. She had unusual distribution of calcifications that were occurring in relation to her cancer.

I asked the radiologist, I said, “Just how long is that area of calcification?” She measured it with her ruler and she said, “9.5 sonometers.” I said, “Well, how wide is the distribution?” She measured 3.5 sonometers. So I pulled a cellphone out of my pocket and I said, “Measure this.”And it was 9.5 x 3.5.

I about fainted. This is the most dramatic example I can think of.

Now, I’ve had other dramatic examples; one that occurs to me as a young woman. Again, none of these women had a family history, worked at a cellphone manufacturing company and the cellphones were on a conveyor belt below the level of her waist, just the lower breast. At age 38, she developed breast cancers in the lower aspect of both breasts. I’ve never seen that pattern before.

And all these women that I’ve been dealing with, that I’ve been collecting have no family history – at least the ones that I’m reporting on. I do get [inaudible 00:18:31] on the Oz Show. I got a tremendous response from women who thought they might have a cellphone-related breast cancer.

But once we reach at a certain age, cancer becomes common and using cellphones becomes common. And to my great surprise, storing the cellphone in the bras is remarkably common. So I can’t really make much out of those case. But when I get a woman under 30 and started collecting a series of them, it starts making me really nervous.

And we published this series of four of the women a couple of years ago and it got a lot of attention. It showed a detailed analysis of the mammograms and the pathology, et cetera and they all seem to have a very consistent pattern. And so this consistency of the pattern has convinced me that there is a problem.

And so what are the solutions? Well, I’m not going to stand up in my soap box anymore and say, “Cellphones can cause breast cancer,” but I said, “Read the safety information that comes along with the cellphone” – that is if you can find it on the Internet. And virtually every cellphone manufacturer now says, “Keep your cellphone at least a half an inch from the skin.”

Now, I’ concerned that the breast is a particularly sensitive organ in its early stages of development. So teenage women who have chest x-rays we know are increased with for early onset breast cancer. And I think the same vulnerability may be for microwave irradiation. I think that maybe older women might get by with this behavior, but I think particularly for these young women –

What worries me, these highschool girls and college girls, it’s routine behavior.

DEBRA: It is.

DR. JOHN WEST: We did one study of college girls that show that 40% of them stored their cellphone in their bra at least once during the day and 3% stored it in their bra for more than 10 hours.

So these are the women just like with the cell-phone related brain cancers where we know that early onset and long duration are associated with this increased risk of – or at least proposed to be an increased risk of brain cancers. The same will apply even more so to breast because the breast being a vulnerable organ and very young women – you know, women starting at a very young age and with prolonged storage, maybe exposing some of these particularly sensitive women to early onset breast cancer.

And in fact, if this proves to be the case, just think of what it implies. Over the next decade, we’re going to have hundreds of thousands of women who have been exposed that don’t know what to do. What do you tell a 19-year or girl or tell the mother of a 19-year old girl who has noted that their daughter has been storing their cellphone in their bra for years and then doesn’t know what to do next now that she knows that it is a risk.

DEBRA: I’m sorry ot interrupt. I’m sorry, Dr. West, but our time is up. It’s time to go to commercial. I so appreciate you being here for this segment. If you’d like to go to Dr. West website and find out more about breast cancer and how cellphones affect it, just go to ToxicFreeTalkRadio.com and I have the websites for all the guests that are on today there in the show description.

And so ToxicFreeTalkRadio.com. This has been Dr. John West and he has lots more information on his website. You’re listening to Toxic Free Talk Radio. I’m Debra Lynn Dadd and we’ll be right back.

= COMMERCIAL BREAK =

DEBRA: You’re listening to Toxic Free Talk Radio. I’m Debra Lynn Dadd. Today, we’re talking about cellphones and the Berkeley “Right to Know” ordinance that will require retailers to pass out a fact sheet telling about what is the safest distance to store and hold a cellphone.

We have several guests scheduled today and our scheduled guest for this segment, Dr. Devra Lee Davis didn’t answer the phone and I think I know why. She told me when we scheduled her that she thought this time would be fine, but that her daughter is expecting a baby. So I’m thinking that she might have rushed to the hospital with her daughter while she gives birth.

So we’ll reschedule her because Dr. Davis has a lot to say about cellphones. She’s just returned from India where she has some new research. And so we’ll just reschedule her and give her a whole hour.

So Ellie, do you want to tell us a little bit about what Dr. Davis was going to talk about?

ELLEN MARKS: Well, I think Devra was going to talk about some research that has been done recently on reproductive health with cellphone radiation. I don’t know all of it, I’m not a scientist, but I can tell you that there has been considerable science over the years – there’s been studies out of Cleveland Clinic and Harvard and Yale about damage to sperm and damage to fetuses.

Now, as far as sperm goes, what the science has found is that when cellphones are carried in the pocket on and connected to a wireless network, that sperm is not only being damaged, but sperm count is down.

So this is a serious concern. I don’t believe there’s been any studies as to what this is doing to a woman’s reproductive organs and to eggs, but I can only imagine. So there’s considerable concern about when a man keeps a phone in a pocket.

And also, we are definitely concerned about women keeping them near their abdomen when their pregnant. Dr. Dee-Kun Li at Oakland Kaiser has done some research on this and found that cellphone radiation does affect fetuses.

There’s talk about it increasing behavior. There’s a study out of Yale. There’s been talks about cellphone radiation. This was a study done on rats where it showed symptoms such as ADHD where the rats who were exposed to the radiation while in utero, young rats, they exhibited signs of ADHD and unusual behaviors where the rats who were not exposed to the radiation did not do this.

So there’s concerns about that. There’s been some studies about damage to fetuses. Actually, there’s a woman who lives up in [inaudible 00:30:01] who was a realtor. She kept cellphones in both pockets while she was pregnant. Unfortunately, her 4-year old died from glioma. And that is the type of brain tumor attributed to cellphone use.

So we’re obviously very concerned. I’m not exactly sure what else Devra was going to go into today, but she’s definitely a leading expert on this issue.

DEBRA: And we’ll have her. We’ll have her on again. I’ll reschedule her first, so that she can…

ELLEN MARKS: Yes, and I apologize for that. I’d like to say a couple of things if we have the time. Berkeley is doing the right thing. Other cities and states have tried to do similar things in the past and they’ve been met with campaign contributions from industry to legislators. They’ve been met with litigation by this industry who claims that anything that a city or state does in regard to this is a violation of their first amendment rights. Well, what about our rights to know about these ubiquitous devices that even children are using.

So we’re really proud of Berkeley. And Harvard law professor, constitution law professor, Larry Lessig has helped us draft this legislation and he will defend this pro bono for the city of Berkeley and the industry. He feels that the way in which this is written will stand up in court because like I said before, it’s not compelling speech and it is not controversial.

So Berkeley is a city that is progressive and they stand up for their constituents’ right and we’re really proud of them. And I think you might know they recently passed a soda tax.

DEBRA: Yes! I just heard that on the news.

ELLEN MARKS: Yes! And we’re very proud of them for this. And it’s similar. They’re standing up to big industries who are profiting at the expense of our children and grandchildren. They’re not alone. I mean, the president’s cancer panel has warned – I think it was in 2010 – the president that cellphone radiation is a potential public health risk and a great one for the 21st century.

The World Health Organization has classified cellphone radiation a possible carcinogen. The American Academy of Pediatrics had spoken out about this. They wrote a letter to the FCC in 2013 and they said “children are not little adult and they’re not disproportionately impacted by environmental exposures including cellphone radiation.”

They went on to say “current FCC standards do not account for the unique vulnerability and use patterns specific to pregnant women and children. It is essential that any new standard for cellphones or other devices be based on protecting the youngest and most vulnerable population.”

They also asked for the FCC to provide “meaningful consumer disclosures.” And that’s exactly what we’re doing.

And also, the government accountability office in 2012 issued a report on this called ‘Exposure & Testing Requirements for Mobile Phones Should be Re-assessed.” And this is an important point.

What they said is, “The FCC has not re-assessed its test requirements to ensure that they identified the maximum RF exposure a user could experience. Some consumers may use mobile phones against the body, which the FCC does not currently test and could result in RF energy exposure higher than the FCC limit.”

So the FCC and the manufacturers are not currently testing these phones as used and that’s where these disclosures are coming from. So the public needs to know this.

DEBRA: Absolutely.

ELLEN MARKS: And yes, what Dr. West said is so important. Many women, young women, young mothers who are busy with their kids and need their hands are putting their cellphones in their bra.

If this is true (and it sounds like there is a correlation), people need to know. We can’t wait until it’s too late like we did with [inaudible 00:34:18], like we did with smoking.

So it’s very important information that Dr. West shared with you. But also, he did this case series with Dr. Lisa Bailey…

Wendy: And before you tell us about that, we need to go to break and we’ll have more time when we come back.

ELLEN MARKS: Okay. Okay, great. Thank you.

Wendy: You’re listening to Toxic Free Talk Radio. I’m Debra Lynn Dadd. And today, we’re talking about cellphones and breast cancer and other types of cancer, other dangers and my guest is Ellen Marks. She’ll be back with us. We also have on Dr. West. She’ll be back after the break and we’ll talk more about this.

= COMMERCIAL BREAK =

DEBRA: You’re listening to Toxic Free Talk Radio. I’m Debra Lynn Dadd. My guest today is Ellen Marks and we’re talking about the new Berkeley “Right to Know” ordinance for customers to know what is – I don’t want to say ‘a safe distance’ because I’m not sure that – I mean, there’s a warning, but I’m not sure that it’s actually safe. It’s probably safer to use it at this distance.

But you know, I was thinking, I’m still hearing Dr. West’s words at the end of his segment when he was saying, “Once you find out about that it causes cancer and that you’ve been using this phone, what are you supposed to do?” My only solution that I know – I only know two things. One is to use some kind of device like a Pong case to reduce the amount of radiation and number two is to just not use a cellphone.

I mean, I don’t know how old you are, but I can remember when we didn’t have cellphones. I can remember when we didn’t have answering machines. You had to be there. Yeah, I’m a hundred years old.

ELLEN MARKS: That’s true. I was just telling my 28-year old daughter that the other day, how when I was a young teenager, we actually call our friends and if they weren’t home, it just rang and rang. We didn’t even have an answering machine.

DEBRA: That’s right.

ELLEN MARKS: But this technology is not going to go away and we need to be realistic about that. I do agree with you that I don’t think that they’re safe. The FCC limits do not protect us from the reality of them. They only protect us from the thermal damage that’s possibly being done and not from the non-thermal damage.

The science, thousands of studies have shown that damage is being done to us by this radiation, by this non-ionizing radiation at non-thermal levels, levels far below the FCC standard. So the reality is even keeping it at a small distance, while it’s better, is it safe? No, it’s not safe.
So people, I don’t think we need to abandon the technology. As I’ve said before, it’d be great if the industry would step up to the problem and release the patents they have on safer equipments. In the interim, I think we just need to learn unfortunately and have government warn us or advice us of the fact that the phones are not being tested to our bodies and that this language is in the manuals and we need to find an alternative. We need to keep them off, we shouldn’t be sleeping with them on. I think it’s 87% of teenagers sleep with them underneath their pillow at night. They want to get their text messages. They use it as their alarm clock. They need to know that this shouldn’t be happening.

DEBRA: Yeah, I think that there’s a false sense that people think that cellphones are safe and they just use them for everything. I know a number of people who don’t even have a landline. And so if they’re going to talk on the phone, they’re always talking on their cellphone.

I don’t do that. I have a landline and I give people my cellphone number, but I say, “Do not call me on my cellphone because I do not spend time talking on my cellphone. I just use it for emergencies or if I’m traveling. When I’m out, I carry out with me in my purse or I leave it in my car when I’m driving around or something like that in case – because sometimes, I do need to have – in the States, you need to have a phone when you’re out because there’s no such thing as a payphone anymore. Remember pay phones? Remember phone booths?

ELLEN MARKS: Yeah. Now, they’re turning them into wireless hotspots.

DEBRA: Yeah.

ELLEN MARKS: So I agree with you and unfortunately, there’s many people though who use this for business reasons. I will tell you a personal story. My husband is unfortunately someone who has been affected by this. He has a brain tumor that has been attributed more likely than not to his cellphone use. Thankfully, he’s doing well and he’s still working and he’s in the real estate industry. If he didn’t have a cellphone, he’d be out of business. He wouldn’t be able to earn a living. They’d be on to the next person.

So what he does is he never holds it to his head. He never keeps it on in a pocket or anywhere on his body. He doesn’t sleep with it at night. We keep them in another room at night. We don’t have wi-fi in our house. So he’s learned the hard way that he needed to make changes.

Until the industry does something to stop war gaming this and to fess up to the fact that there is a problem, then we need to make the changes ourselves. And that’s why with what Berkeley is doing, we are trying to raise awareness that there is an issue, that cellphones are not safe as they are used. They’re not meant to be held in the bra, not meant to be held in a pants pocket in the front or back.

There was just a scientific study that came out the other day that colon cancers are in the rise in 20- to 34-year olds, which is very unusual. They did not find the reason. They didn’t correlate cellphone use, but my colleagues are wondering about this and hope that there will be more research.

So we need to find alternatives. And it’s funny what you said because some of the manuals even go as far as to say, “Limit your use.”

DEBRA: Wow!

ELLEN MARKS: People don’t know that. A lot of people in Berkeley do not have landlines. You’re absolutely right. They’re quite expensive and they’ve given it up. They figured if they have a cellphone, they don’t need a landline.

And by the way, I don’t know if you’re familiar with this, but cordless home phones are probably as injurious as cellphones. The base station emit the same radiations.

So we try to tell people to use a corded landline. That’s what I’m on right now and it’s probably what you’re on.

DEBRA: That is what I’m on. And I’ll tell you, I had an EMF expert. Actually, I had a whole class of consultants who are being trained in this ‘come to my house’ and all of them measured the EMFs all over my house and the number place where the EMFs were most strongly emitting was in my cordless phone sitting maybe two feet away from where I sit all day long.

And when they showed me the levels, I went straight into the outside garbage and I went and bought a corded landline and that was it. I have never used one since.

ELLEN MARKS: You and I think a lot because I also have an RF device that measures RF. And I had cordless home phones. And when I realized what they were doing, what they measured (they were very high), I threw them away.

DEBRA: Very high.

ELLEN MARKS: My husband said, “You’re selling those. You’re giving them away, right?” I said, “No, they’re going in the garbage.”

DEBRA: No. Mine went in the garbage and you know, people sleep with them right next to their bed all night. It goes right through the wall. The wall doesn’t keep the radiation from going through into another room.

ELLEN MARKS: Exactly!

DEBRA: And so I agree with you that it would be unrealistic to think that we’re never going to use this technology. I mean, I know that sometimes – like especially when I travel, I have to have a cellphone because if I’m traveling to a media event, the television show has to be able to reach me on the celphone.

ELLEN MARKS: Exactly!

DEBRA: And so people expect that you’re going to have that, but that doesn’t mean that you have to be using it in the least, responsible way – or the most irresponsible way, I want to say. And we certainly can reduce our exposure. And everything that we do, it’s like with toxic chemicals we’ve talked about on this show, the more you can do to reduce your exposure, the better off you’re going to be. And the more that you can reduce the amount that you use your cellphone, the better off you’re going to be. The more you can do to protect yourself, the more you do to reduce your exposure.

And that’s why this ordinance is so important. I think this ordinance should be in every city around the world.

ELLEN MARKS: Well, that is our goal.

DEBRA: Yeah.

ELLEN MARKS: And the way that the Professor Lessig wrote this, it’s so minimal that we hope that it will stand up in court because this industry is despicable, they probably will sue. He wrote in a manner which will stand up in court and we will take this across the nation.
DEBRA: Yes.

ELLEN MARKS: And it’s a start. Berkeley was the first study in California to enact second-hand smoking legislation years ago and look where we are now. So we’ve come a long way with that and hopefully, this is the beginning and we’ll take off across the nation and eventually, it will be more.

DEBRA: Well, even if it doesn’t pass and there is no ordinance, the fact that you’re talking about it, the fact that we’re having this show today (and I know you’ll continue to get as much media attention as you can on this), people are hearing this and they’re getting educated.

ELLEN MARKS: Absolutely!

DEBRA: And that’s the whole point, for people to know.

ELLEN MARKS: Many of my colleagues, they say even if it does not pass (which we hope it does), it’s not a loss because we are getting media attention – and thank you for this. And we are getting the word out there.

And people want to be educated. We recently released the movie called Mobilize about this and we’ve shown it on some college campuses and it won an award for best documentary at the recent film festival. People really want this information. This is the ubiquitous device their children are using and sleeping with. It’s 24/7.

So they really want this information. The public wants it and needs it.

DEBRA: Well, I’m so glad that you’re doing this.

ELLEN MARKS: Well, thank you.

DEBRA: And as I said at the beginning of the show, the way I found out about you was that you and others did a protest for including warning labels on phones in San Francisco, in southern San Francisco. I think that that’s brilliant and brave and we need more, more people standing out to say what are the dangers of cellphones and other toxic products and things that are affecting our health in a negative way.
How can we see the movie, Mobilize? Is it on the website someplace?

ELLEN MARKS: It is available on Vimeo. We also have the DVDs and people can contact me. Can I give you an email?

DEBRA: Sure!

ELLEN MARKS: Okay, it’s CABTA@EllenKMarks.com. I can tell them how to get the video and we are also interested in showing it across the nation. If groups wants this shown, we can do that and we can have just speakers there.

DEBRA: Good! So that’s all the time we have for today. You can go to ToxicFreeTalkRadio.com and get all the information on all the speakers, all the guests that are on today.

This show will be transcribed. It will be available next Tuesday. So if you just go to ToxicFreeTalkRadio.com, look up the show and you’ll be able to read the transcripts and share it with your friends and let everybody know about this issue.

I’m Debra Lynn Dadd. This is Toxic Free Talk Radio. Be well!